according to the base game Prima Guide, the position of fallen asleep sims depends on the amount of space around them.

Rod and the Gypsy show up too soon, often before my sim arrives in the move in taxi. I wish there were a time set for them to show up a bit later. If a porch is too small, one will always get in the way of the other causing a traffic jam.

That's interesting. Rod always arrives after the paper carrier in my game, and the gypsy often doesn't arrive at all. I wonder what one of us has that the other doesn't?
Because you clearly need it, or need to get rid of it...

Gypsy is banned by Visitor Controller by default. It may be reason why you don't see her.
Sometimes Rod arrives together with my sim and sometimes a much later. I think it is something to do with lot.

I don't have the Visitor Controller, so that is definitely not it. Also, she does come sometimes, just not always. Ditto the garden club, now I think of it.

You're right. They CAN'T!!! They can have as high a class performance as you want, but the Exam is *MANDATORY*. Not doing the exam means that nobody will be able to test how much of the subject you have picked up. They'll assume that you'd have failed.

It's like driving under the influence: if you refuse to do the alcohol test, they'll assume that it is to hide the exorbitant amount you have been consuming. Therefor, you must be drunk, and cannot be allowed to drive.
Or like being interrogated about a crime: if you have a verifyable alibi, then you might very well be innocent. But if you refuse to give an alibi, or if they can poke big holes through whatever you try to make them believe, then they'll assume that your guilt is more likely than your innocence.



Actually, if she were to do an exam, she would pass with flying colours. See that little white line near the bottom of the bar? THAT is the minimum they need to pass. When they've passed that line, they will no longer fail the exam for that semester, but they still have to attend the exam, ofcourse.

In real life, yes, the final exam may be mandatory depending on the class. In Sims, no. If you look at the message warning you about the exam, it says "Not attending the final exam will hurt X's grade for this semester". It does not say they will fail, all it says is that it will cause a drop in grades. I assumed that if they meant "you will fail regardless of your pre-exam grade", it would have said "not attending the final exam will result in failing this semester". It says grade drop because that's what happen. If you have a sufficiently high grade, you will pass even if you skip it. You won't get a good grade, but you will pass.

To make sure I'm not talking out of my ass saying it's vanilla when it's not, I tested it in AGS without mods, and it acts the same way. It's definitely just a penalty, not an automatic fail. If you keep your Sim occupied right as the final exam ends, it can't switch semester (it's an active interaction that it pushes when the exam ends), so you can see what their grade meter is before the new semester starts and measure how big of a drop it is.

You're welcome to test it yourself if you don't believe me.



Yes, and the moment after returning from the exam with her A+, she'd die. I already said she's too sick from her pregnancy to take the exam. Her hunger drops so quickly that it barely increases when she eats. Once she's gulped down enough to be at 1/4 of the bar, she's about to pass out from exhaustion. She sleeps until she's too hungry to sleep, then repeats the same process.

And yes, I am well aware that I could cheat her motives to keep her alive, but getting her A+ is not my goal. I enjoy variety, and for this Sim I am willing to help her out enough for her to pass without going, but that's it. In real life, you have to lower your ambition if your health gets in the way.

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While testing this it's clear that I put my threshold at least one pixel higher than it actually is. I doubt anyone but me is nerdy enough to really care, but I like being able to tell exactly what will happen. Once I am done figuring out the missed exam penalty, I'm going to measure how much of a bonus you get from attending. I have a couple of popularity/pleasure Sims that would be more than happy to not study a single drop more than necessary

I've had a couple of sims who couldn't attend final exams but still managed to pass the semester. As I recall, one was similar to your sim in that she was pregnant and struggling to keep her motives up, and the other one had to stay at home with her baby because there was nobody else available to look after him, so she couldn't go to her exam.

It is okay to beat up the bride at her wedding. Reputations go up!

Well, then I stand corrected.

But wait, you talking again about that poor pregnant girl that you were torturing, having her live in a noisy single-room apartment? You cruel monster, you?
I would never, ever do such evil things to my sims. So that's why I didn't know, obviously.

My sim was closer to max then that and failed. Maybe it depends also on aspiration or personality or just chance, I don't know. But I've been careful ever since to get sims to final exam.

discovered a number of days ago:: married sims cry if their spouse moves out through at least computer.

I found out that Sims can't try for baby on a community lot bed. Yes, they're in the same household. Yes, I know they can't sleep on community lot beds. Just WooHoo was available. Weird.

My Uni sims spend the first day or two doing assignments, term paper and, if needed, the required skills to fill the meter bar. They never go to classes but always go to finals. If the meter bar is all the way up and they skip finals, would this drop their meter bar level some?

Yes, lots. As I said my sim failed. Gummi has had other results with sims just passing.

I think you are perhaps confusing her with my street performer who lives in a large one-room loft. It's only noisy because she insists on turning on the stereo before going to bed, and that's hardly my fault I'm rarely evil to my Sims, I'm even nice enough to code mods for them to stop them from their own masochist behavior

I would imagine the fact that you did not know has more to do with a dislike of pleasure/popularity Sims, than it does not being evil to your Sims. I love pleasure/popularity, and I have tons of Sims who go to University to party and meet people, rather than study. I enjoy finding ways for my Sims to achieve what they need without having to study endlessly and without cheats, whether it be skills or school-studying. Just like real people, some of my Sims are quite happy to never learn how to cook anything more advanced than mac n cheese, and spend that time hanging out with friends instead. If all else fails, there's always pizza delivery



Yes, it would not surprise me if there are other factors that affect it. I've only tested with Knowledge Sims, not sure about personality differences. And who knows, maybe this is another case where my game has a predictable set-in-stone pattern and yours for some reason is random, like the time to write novel situation.



Yes, skipping the final will decrease their grade meter. If you look at my post on the previous page, #195, you can see how much it decreased from max in my game. Can't guarantee your results will match mine, but might give you an idea at least

Sims gain social when jamming together in a band Nice little touch

I don't cheat when it comes to studying skills, or performing properly in school or college. If they can't get there without cheats, I don't even *want* them there.

Why do I not like Popularity and Pleasure sims? Because they are all about either throwing parties (which I suck at... I never seem to get the party score anywhere beyond "Mehhhhh") or stupid wants like play game, meet new guy, play game, dance a little, play game, eat shit, drop dead, get lost, sing a song of love and hate... ad nauseam! And on top of all that non-productive clutter, they want to BUY BUY BUY stuff that they never EARNED EARNED EARNED the MONEY MONEY MONEY for...

The most frustrating time I had recently, was with a *Fortune* sim who, once in college, rolled not a single skilling or college want - only clutter -, and never ever did anything to advance his grades except arriving in time for every class and every exam, and actually made graduation! It was just a long-winded, boring process with him continuously staring in the gaping maws of desperation because after two days of doing the same crud, I just lost interest in fulfilling any of his wants anymore. He didn't autonomously paint, make music, dance... just talk to guys, get into poking and shoving bouts, and not accomplish anything.
He was just fortunate that what few skill points he had, were in the skills which he needed for his Major (psychology). Except that he missed two points in Charisma. You should know, that I have a mod (by AncientHighway, I believe) that allows sims to autonomously gain charisma skill at any mirror. All my sims make a habit of doing that till it sickens me. And this sim had used that power a few times before he went to college. But if you thought that he made any effort when he finally *was* in college, you are sadly mistaken. He just coasted through those two semesters where charisma was important, at the minimum level.

As I said, most frustrating.

Now, I'm not saying that a sim who learns little can't have an interesting life. But they must make it interesting for *me* as well. I'm certainly not going to try to make them do stuff that they roll no wants for. Nor am I going to muddle through college with them again, if their heart isn't in it.
And study doesn't have to be bad, boring or endless. But if they want to achieve their career goals, they'll have to get there without making *me* jump through too many hoops. It's *their* life, after all

Understand, if someone else has fun doing that, power to them. But it's just not my cup of ginger tea with mint and honey.

What you find frustrating I find interesting, I enjoy having a diverse lot at college, some might study, some might do nothing but socialize and perhaps some might hack grades and sleep with professors for grades. Sims like that I watch half in amusement half in trepidation to see if they will pass or fail. Why do they need to roll college wants? Writing a term paper is hardly a riveting thing. Of course I also only have college for 8 days since 24 is too long for any sim for me.

Boiling Oil, getting a good party score is easy. Invite people who are already friends. Don't have the stereo on or you risk a smustle outbreak. At college you may have to interrupt attempts to turn it into a study session. If you serve a meal rather than a buffet and call the guests to eat it, start a hangout session, or run a woohoo date simultaneously there's no way you won't have a good party. If they're all good enough friends you may not even have to do any of that.

My Sims throw parties ALL the time - no matter what their aspirations! Every promotion is either celebrated by a party or a group outing to a community lot. Sundays are for family reunions.
Dinner parties always work - that is why my Sims all have to have a LOT of cooking points. (And also why I like to put a huge table in the kitchen). And the host toasts the guests around him/her.
Games work - even if they go out for a group water balloon fight or a huge snowball fight.
Of course, if Mr NoNicePoints is invited, he will probably beat up one of the guests and make a new enemy - and the party guests can watch the fight and cheer their hearts out!
No bar - some guests will hang around there and then find the party boring Serve those bubbly bottles fermented juice to the guests.
Bring in the stereo late - out of the host's inventory - and, if qualified, teach the guests the hula or the slap dance (until the police arrives)
and that should give a full party score.

I would love to see a picture of this!!!!

Because I'm not going to make them toil and slave for hours on something that they get no aspiration points for. The aspiration meter goes down all by itself, but they need to accomplish stuff to get it back up. That means fulfill wants. And it doesn't need to be the want to write a term paper... But they could at least occasionally roll the want to go to class, or to do group research with someone. That way, they would show me that I didn't send them to college just for shit. If their aspiration level goes down, they start looking up at *me*, as if it's *my* fault. And on the other hand, I'm not going to fill a million wants in the 250-500 points range in a row either, because that makes *me* unhappy. Seeing a sim roll the same sequence of "appreciate johnny, tell joke to Johnny, play with Johnny" over and over again, gets old in a hurry!

As said before, I don't mind if they are like that, but I don't want to spend sim day after sim day dragging them through the Dorm hallways against their will. But I'll be damned if I let them go make a failure of themselves and get expelled. Because then, not only they, but also their family members are in distress, and *I* have to fix it all again!

So, if they wanna be like that, I'd rather know it during their Teen days, so I can have them simply grow up to adults in the end, and then the fun can begin.

For example, I find it very gratifying to play Don Lothario until he dies of natural causes, without him ever gaining another skill point. If he rolls the *want* for one, I will oblige. But not otherwise. And he is good fun to play that way, too.

You don't have to fix it. Nobody's forcing you to do that - you choose to do that because you like to keep your sims fulfilled and happy. If a sim is frustrating you, try something different. You could go out of your way to satisfy their worst fears. Or if one of them really bugs you, SMITE HIM!

In one of my early versions of Pleasantview, I went out of my way to fix broken marriages, make friends out of enemies, etc. I ended up with a near-Utopia full of happy fulfilled sims who all got along with each other and fulfilled all their lifelong dreams and only ever died of old age when I became bored with them and took away their supply of Elixir. I stopped playing this neighborhood around the time the Pleasant twins had toddlers of their own because it had become THE SINGLE MOST BORING NEIGHBORHOOD IN MY GAME!

This time around, I'm going to make it fun! Maybe I'll satisfy a few fears. I will STOP going out of my way to prevent accidental deaths (lightning, disease, etc). University is way too easy, so I'm going to make a determined effort to get somebody to flunk out. Mickey Dosser of La Fiesta Tech seems a good candidate for that. I have Cyjon's Bigger Bills mod too. Maybe an excellent student will be forced to drop out because he/she can't afford to stay in school.

I'm not saying your style of play is "wrong" or anything. Just consider trying something different once in awhile. Especially if the way you're playing it now is making you frustrated and angry.

@RoxEllen1965: Hahahahaha, yes, you're right. Because I cannot live with my sims being unhappy, I have a sickly need to fix it if they are in distress. That's how I play my game. But if the entire family is in distress, because one stupid SoB drops out, it's not their fault! Something NEEDS to be done about it.

And I've done the "smite him, because he pisses me off" thing as well as the "make his worst fears come true" thing. At the moment of punishment, it is EXTREMELY rewarding and fulfilling. But eventually, that wears off. And even if it didn't wear off, it didn't fix the family's moods either.
This one guy, one of the children of Ginger Newson, will never be able to stand in the shadow of his older sisters Zoraya and Yoranda, but he could still be an enjoyable sim to play, if only he makes up his mind about what he wants to do. But if he just keeps stumbling around by the seat of his pants, then he may end up a townie.

I'm not saying anyone should play like me, either. I'm simply amazed to hear about all the different approaches, and want to share mine as well. Actually, my first ever YA has screwed me up for good! She was a CAS-made YA, for whom I started with the default Scorpio personality, and dragged around the sliders just enough to make her more like a Virgo, but without her Sign actually changing. And then I jammed a Knowledge Aspiration on her. And this girl really spoiled me rotten!!! At that time I had not yet heard of mods, so my game was vanilla. She made full use of the entire 24 days, maxed all skills, rolled wants to do Assignments, write Term Papers, go to Class, do Group Research, the works. She also gained max enthusiasm in both Arts & Crafts and Music & Dance, and was running around the dorm all day, autonomously cleaning shit up. She would go ballistic over a puddle! She wasn't very pleasant, socially. You'd sooner get her fist across your jaw than a kiss on your cheek. But she was FUN to play for 24 jam-packed days of action. With that sim, there was never a dull moment, she was always busy! The only times that she was not active, was when she slept. In the second half of her Junior year, she finally realised that one of her female fans (whom I later discovered to be one of the premade SS members) was very interesting indeed. And she did everything she could, to let that girl know how she felt about it. I didn't have to help her much.

Now, *that* has become a kind of standard that I measure my sims by. If they want to go to college, I want them to show at least 5% of that kind of passion! Maybe that explains a little of why I play the way I do.
Anyway, the way I'm playing is not the cause of my frustration. As a result of my slection method, most sims that end up in college, do well enough not to tick me off. It was just this one sim... Who is probably going to pay for it, for the rest of his linteresting life.