I have always enjoyed taking part in building contests. (I never won any, but I learned a lot and all of them were fun).

The contests used to be quite popular and when @Zarathustra launched one a while back, I was very excited. Unfortunately, there were not enough contestants for the contest to continue and since then, nothing has happened.

Some of us thought starting a discussion about contests may be helpful, because some of us want contests back Of course, I am interested in a building contest, but hopefully it will be the start of all kinds of contests, like there used to be!

THEMES OF CONTESTS

(some of these have been used, but it was ages ago) that I personally like for building contests are the following:

1. Owned Businesses.

These will have to be rather small, so that a sim business owner can afford it? Apart from a bakery and a grocery, perhaps a shop specializing in something (I had a very successful business selling lights in my own hood once). The contestant builds 5 businesses in 5 rounds for sims to own.

2. Nightlife plus.

The contestants build 5 lots in 5 rounds for sims who want to go out, whether it is a family restaurant, a sport venue, a nightclub, an art gallery or a community spa.

3. Building styles/architecture.

Contestants build 4 residential lots and a community lot in the same style (of their choice) eg. Victorian, Tudor, Art Deco, etc.

RULES

The basic rule, with some adjustments by different hosts, in past contests have worked quite well and I don't believe in fixing something that isn't broken.

CUSTOM CONTENT

In the first rounds, there will always be a budget limit - eg. your lot must not be more than 30 000 (or whatever) Simoleons. Custom content is often cheaper than vanilla content and that, imho, makes it a bit unequal. It is because of that that there used to be some bonus points for builders not using cc.

A decision should be taken on: 1. no custom content 2. Limited custom content (say 3 items per lot) 3. any custom content but bonus points for a vanilla build (how many points? 2 or 3 perhaps)? Or 4. A list of allowed cc decided on by the host (eg. Honeywell's Bespoke build set)? Please make your suggestions.

CONTEST SCHEDULE

How long should a contest run? I think there are set rules, but I know some contests have run for longer (hosts are allowed, it seems, to take into account contestants ending up in hospital and other unfortunate events, and they do happen). There has always been a reserve judge, though, so the judging could take place when all the entries were in.

Personally, I think contestants should have one week to submit an entry, and judges should have one week to judge it. That means a contest will run around 10 weeks? I also think the timetable should be stuck to despite any unfortunate events.

YOUR INPUT IS IMPORTANT HERE.

We would love your feedback. Tell us what you think about the themes, the rules, the timetable, anything that excites or bothers you. Please see a bit of discusson here:

https://modthesims.info/showthread....5#startcomments

The idea of a contest has already been approved

Tagging some simmers, but EVERYONE is invited to join in this discussion, we need all of you to make a success of this.

@simsample @Yvelotic2001 @joandsarah77 @Zarathustra @Charity @LauraPamplonaS

Yes please. I like all sorts of contests - well except ones that require many generations, with lots of rules. So guess I should say I like contests if they are quick. Also strange/horrible.
As for architecture, it's the CC that is problematic. With NO CC the only thing interesting is if layout and Maxis content are unusual. I really LIKE to see CC, it makes a house interesting, and in a period house (as Tudor or MSM) the furnishing makes it come to life. For me, I would like truly authentic architecture, which would require a few CC, with pictures of a fully furnishes house (which would require way too much CC- which I would like links to!), and available unfurnished. So I would like to have contests that specify "no CC", or "limited CC', rather than a point system.
So what would you actually be judging? Functionality? Eye appeal? Architectural correctness?- I would love to see that.
PS: my personal style is function; so when I make a house for my family that will be over 20 sims & pets, it ain't pretty, but it works.

To be honest, I would suck at a building contest. I avoid building as much as I can. I download pre made homes and even use the Maxis ones. XD

But if you need help setting things up then I'm game.

I used to love contests, but I prefer taking pictures of sims more than lots (or building lots - not my thing, really), so I'm more in favor of picture-taking (scenery, sims and such), modelling (ish, anyway), or storytelling contests. But everyone has their peferences

I also prefer not too many rounds. I've often seen that the more rounds there are, the fewer people are left at the end of the contest. You're binding to a time schedule, and while it can seem to work at the start of the contest, people tend to get busy with their lives. 1-3 rounds seem to be fine most of the time, but would absolutely see how much interest there is before adding more rounds, especially if there aren't a lot of contestants. 2+ months is quite long to run a contest, and you could risk losing contestants just from the time alone.

CC/no-CC... Depends on the type of contest. I get the no-CC/limited-CC for building (although I do think CC adds some interest - maybe limited/MM could work?), but feel anything with sims and scenery would be a bit boring or same-y without at least some CC. I prefer using CC.

I have so much CC that I wouldn't be interested in something without it or restricted. Too much work and less options.

Regarding custom content, I see the problem with the pricing and it's something that bothers me even when playing for myself and not in a contest - some items are simply way too cheap compared to their "peers", especially those that cost 1 simoleon. So maybe either limit CC to, for example, build mode stuff, or have contestants ask the judges if they can use specific items, though that would be more effort than just a blanket limited/forbidden list. Bonus points for vanilla build I don't think would work very well as you'd be limiting what you can do with the build and maybe end up with a lower score than if you had just taken the penalty (as I like to say, if the penalty is a fine then it's only a crime for the poor).

As for scheduling, is it necessary for judges to have a full week of judging before the next round starts? Can't the next round and the previous round's judging overlap and that would save some time? Granted, I don't remember how it was done in previous contests. Maybe 4 rounds is the sweet spot to make it not too short and also not lose too much enthusiasm from the contestants.

I don't really like the owned business theme but that's just a matter of personal preference since those lots would be on the cheaper side when I prefer to go wild while the nightlife and building styles ideas give more flexibility when it comes to the price tag. As an added bonus, both of those would "force" me to actually resume projects I started ages ago.

How can you have the next round's judging if you don't know who made it through from the previous round yet?

So long as it's not an elimination bracket or something like that, you can absolutely have contestants starting on the next round while judging is still going on for the previous one. I think that's a pretty compelling argument in favor of scoring with a point system, that way you're not going to be losing contestants by design every round.

And as far as CC, I'm coming from a different side than many people since I make a point of not using it, but I also wouldn't want to see it banned in a contest. I think the approach that's been used before of awarding a nominal amount of bonus points for a no-CC entry works well - not so much that it's going to be a huge swing in the evaluated scores, but enough that it somewhat counterbalances the advantage of using CC, and evens the playing field (obviously it depends on how a particular contest gets set up to determine the best balancing here)

I also agree that too big of a contest is probably not the best way to draw back crowds (I think that was one of the biggest reasons my Olympics contest flopped), I wonder about even just doing single room design somehow, rather than a full lot. (Unfinished idea- would something like the TV show "Chopped" work, where for each round you're told what type of room (living room, kitchen, bedroom, etc.) you're designing, and then given a short list of items (some simple and straightforward, others strange to require more creativity) you have to include somehow?)

I don't mind if CC is included or banned.

Previous contests I have really enjoyed have been the ones with a bit of a story to them. I absolutely LOVED the renovation contest but it was a very complex one. I agree that smaller is likely to be more realistic.

I am not competitive, so for me the scores are not hugely important, though it's nice obviously to receive praise! I think my favourite things about contests in the past have been seeing the feedback that people get around their builds which helps me to improve my own builds in the future, and that sort of "creativity within constraints" because I find that is the best kind for me. Too open-ended, and I get overwhelmed with options. Too constrained and I might not like the theme.

I think I would prefer two weeks to build and I think overlapping is OK, but I have not been a judge so not sure of the logistics of this.

I like the idea of businesses. I don't have enough owned businesses in my game and I never really know where to start with them.

That's not how contests (or at least the ones I took part in) usually work here. Contestants take part in each round and they get a cumulative score that eventually decides the winner like a league format, not a cup-style contest.

Thank you, all of you!

Remember that my suggestions above are just suggestions! I want you to make more, and improve on mine!
 
@grammapat - I am not against using cc myself (I have done so in previous contests) It is important for me to take everything all of you have said into account. When it comes to certain architecture, I agree 100% that the vanilla game is far too limited. The challenge is rather in trying to make it as fair to every contestant as possible. As for what will be judged: normally: building skills, decor, landscaping, playability, etc. Depending on the contest, there may be something else. And then, of course, the rules must be followed.

@Yvelotic2001 - The time for the judges imo will depend on the number of entries. The suggestion for a week is only a suggestion and it can be made shorter. (Judging is quite hard, I have only been a judge once, but the entries were so similar that it does take extreme scrutiny to decide which one wins. I was quite happy to see that I was in line with the more experienced judges ).

@Charity - as I said, I am mostly interested in building contests, but there have been no contests for a very long time, and I want to start somewhere It will also be interesting to know what non-builders would like to see and may want to download!

@simsfreq - I have never minded not winning a contest, I honestly had a lot of fun! The first time I entered a building contest, I knew absolutely NOTHING. I may never win a contest, but I learned a lot, think I made some friends in the building community and in the end could build my custom hoods too. It is a rewarding experience whether one wins or not.

EDIT: Nobody is eliminated during contests, as Zar says above. At the end the winner will be the one with the highest total score.

CC is only unfair if you have a price limit and people try and get around that with cheap CC. If the sky's the limit then everyone has a level playing field.

I would like to see contests for community lots; although, again, CC and mods "make" the lots, and I don't know that I could come up with 5 ideas. I can see how it gets complicated; I think my lots are unique, and I would love to see other lots (or, as suggested, just single ROOMS!) decorated with unlimited CC, with a theme or story. But how to judge?! I would NOT be interested in MAXIS...or wait, I am fascinated by the Maxis build by the Great Z!

That is partly true, but past contests had price limits (getting more expensive in each round, while there is normally no limit in the final round). It does make it more of a challenge to fit your lot within the price range.

I think it is possible to do something that will allow contestants to use enough cc without it being unfair on anyone. You don't have to come up with any ideas, we can have a poll later on. Just a single room, imo, is not a building contest - that should fall under something else.

There have been a great variety in previous contests and I would like to have something interesting myself. As I ponder owned businesses, not all of them will have to be cheap or small, after all Malcolm Landgraab could afford a very expensive one! And community lots - something I use all the time in my own gameplay - will always be a particular favourite of mine.

While I love the idea of contests I don't love building so many builds within the time frame of one. I tend to be a slow builder, and my builds are few and far apart. Even my last build, the hobby lot, took me a few weeks.
I didn't enter the last build contest as it felt too much but I did agree to judge. I don't mind judging if there is a judging sheet set up so we can put in numbers but I never know what to say in the comments.

CC free is much harder which is why I would always give bonus points for not using CC. The game is handicapped when it comes to cohesive sets and colours.
Anyone can grab a CC set and decorate quickly with it knowing that the pieces and colours will all match. When the person gets praised for that CC bedroom they are really being praised on their choice of CC. Unless they actually made the CC, using only Maxis takes a lot more thought and skill which is why I always felt it should be get a bonus point, just for the effort.

I would want small builds if I were to enter.

Hi! Thank you for tagging me!

I am rather "new" in mts, so I never got to participate in one of the past contests. Therefore, I am not so familiar with the way things are run and all, but I would love to be a participant. I would really like all sorts of contests. I am not the best builder, but I would participate in those no doubt; and as for the discussion on custom content, well, I don't think we have to come up with a definite rule, do we? Every contest would have different rules, limitations, and challenges, so sometimes it'd be fun to build with no cc, sometimes with it, and have it be a varied thing.

I also love everything related to storytelling, pictures, maybe even the creation of sims. I am very attracted to those ideas of creating a set of things, like it was mentioned before; for example: creation X lots for downtown, X businesses, X sims (if that kind of contest even exists), all that kind of thing.

Just as a contribution: not in the sims, but I used to host contests in a different site similar to this one, and I have seen that participants thrive on variety; something for everyone, you know? At the same time, I always found it useful to make polls and ask for people's opinions; so it might be worth it to create a google form to gather data. We could ask people the kind of contests they enjoy the most, ask for their take on the cc "issue", and even if long or shorter contests are preferred.

I always hated judging so I won't even nominate myself for that BUT I will be there as a participant as much as I can. :D

All the contests I've ever entered involved Sims. Some were makeovers where you couldn't change the original's face structure but hair, clothes, eyes, and makeup changes were allowed. Either someone would upload a Sim (i.e. "plain Jane"), a self-Sim, or choose a Maxis Sim (we did one makeover with Pascal Curious) to be made over. Others were for a made-up modeling contract (think ANTM) or as if they were applying for a specific job and you created your own Sim entirely for that. I think one contest (maybe here) was to provide a picture of a Sim (or Sims) based on a particular season or holiday.

The Sim contests usually had a couple or three rounds - provide a head shot, a full-body photo and a free picture (your choice). One (or more) picture per each round - it varied from contest to contest. Judging was based both on the Sim and the pictures that had the Sim in them and how well they reflected the specified activity. No limit on CC. I think the seasonal one may have had only had one picture/round/season.

I love the idea of a contest, but timelines for the last few years were a concern for me. I've only ever participated in one, and avoided others because I wasn't sure I'd have time to complete the builds so I didn't want to fill a contestant spot when there are caps on the number of participants. Sometimes I've then kicked myself, because it turns out I did have time. I'll be able to commit to contests that start later this year, but anything in the next two months I'll just spectate (I'm moving again).

For timing, I'd like to see more time made available for building - say 1 week for a small round 1, then on the closure of that, round 2 immediately starting but with 2 weeks for the contestants - meanwhile, the judges provide their results for round 1 a week after it closed and a week before round 2 is due. All subsequent rounds have 2 weeks for building overlapped with the week of judging. That way, the builders can have more time to work and have some response/feedback (even if only a numbered score) before the next round is due.

For CC, I think it's easier to compare when everyone is on the same footing, so either cc free, or very limited to particular predetermined sets sounds good to me. I like the challenge of trying to make cc-free look decent. Creating a cc-free save is easy if you rename your sims 2 folder so a new empty game folder is created. I play with different themed 'hoods with different downloads folders, so am always renaming my sims 2 folders, but having a minimal cc/essential mods only set up is useful for not only building contests but for testing new cc and mods.

For types of contests, I've mostly seen building contests, but sim/family creation with biographies could be interesting too. Foundation contests look like fun, or renovations of the host's lot or of an existing premade lot, where there are restrictions on what can be done.

I like the theme of owned businesses, especially if it were a mix of home businesses and owned lots. While I'd love to focus on OFB type businesses, with rounds focusing on specific badge related businesses, I think there should also be ways for non OFB owners to make similar, crafting station-free lots so more could participate. I like building for specific sims - if the business is to be owned, perhaps either the host should provide a bio of the owner(s) as part of the description of requirements for each round, or the contestant should have to create a bio for the owner of their build, within the limits set by the host.

A theme idea I has was work places as community lots. Every 'hood I build, I build a few community lots that I pretend my sims work at when they disappear with the carpool. City halls, police stations, hospitals, and office buildings could be straight forward rounds and could even be built to accommodate more than one career. Lots for the slacker career levels, the oceanographer, or adventurer careers could be more interesting/challenging, with the build meant only for one or two levels of a career.

Thank you for the replies

@joandsarah77 You make some excellent points and I think I agree with you. It is also much easier for downloaders if they don't have to go around hunting for CC. I think one can perhaps look at limited cc (open underneath stairs comes to mind, I think somebody did that before) - but it is definitely more of a challenge to work with no cc.

I don't think the contest will start that quickly - still some work to be done and I also want to hopefully hear from more players.

You could perhaps allow the build and buy bundles from the Life/Pet/Castaway Story games.

That is a great idea! Also the Store Items (since they are free now)? And, of course, the extracted objects.

I had forgotten about the store items, those would be nice. And yes extracted is not CC.

I haven't entered a contest in years but I do love them 😁. I would suggest keeping it small, small house/business or just a room, life happens and building and/or decorating a whole building in a week when you have work/school/holidays could mean a higher drop out rate. I don't mind if there is CC or not, maybe mix it up with different rounds having different rules, I like the challenge of only using Maxis but I also love my CC 😂.

I agree that a week is not actually very long when you build something for a contest. However, contests cannot run forever, so I will try and see what I can do about convenient timing. Judges do need time as well, and those who have not taken part before may learn quickly that the feedback from the judges is quite important.

In my own experience, small lots do not necessarily take less time than bigger lots (I am terrible with starters; it is never playable enough and there is never enough space for what my sims want to do, like having a party - it takes me longer to build a starter house than a 3-bedroom one). But there are NO plans to have a contest where one will be asked to build enormous lots, it is unpractical in many ways and hard to play on slower systems. In fact, the lot sizes will likely be small to medium for all the rounds. (A room on its own is not a building contest, though).

I am becoming more no-CC or very limited CC after what joandsarah77 said above. I built a complete hood without any, using only white paint (to be fair, the real town looks like that) (Paternoster on my profile) - and I think most of those lots could do reasonably well in a contest. Then I built a vacation hood as well and only used a windmill for decor (because the real town is full of them) - you can see both on my profile. And I am NOT a master builder, I am the one who takes part for fun and to learn, who has never won a single contest, but am very proud of my 3rd and 4th places

Mixing it up: In the past, lots will differ from round to round, and the final round is normally without a price limit and you can use all the cc you want (which makes it equal to all).